he made it sound like he thought the total segregation of the sexes was a plausible scenario and that the human race would be happier under those circumstances than now
see, to me it sounds like you are reaching super, super hard to find how this admittedly not very great chunk of text on gender relations is problematic because you want to be more mad at this guy.
see, to me it sounds like you are reaching super, super hard to find how this admittedly not very great chunk of text on gender relations is problematic because you want to be more mad at this guy.
I am not mad at Yudkowsky and don't really have a reason to be, I genuinely believe that that is what he is saying and frankly don't see how else it could be read.
but if you think i'm reaching, well, no, i'm not reaching
i don't think segregation of the sexes would solve anyone's problems and i don't think many people would go for it
i find that post very weird, frankly, weird enough that i'm confused that we seem to be treating it as reasonable
and it's acting like you can sort men and women into neat little boxes and simplify all of gender relations into 'men and women don't like each other very much' and you don't have to 'reach' to find that objectionable
You are the end result of a “would you push the button” prompt where the prompt was “you have unlimited godlike powers but you appear to all and sundry to be an impetuous child” – Zero, 2022
but if you think i'm reaching, well, no, i'm not reaching
i don't think segregation of the sexes would solve anyone's problems and i don't think many people would go for it
i find that post very weird, frankly, weird enough that i'm confused that we seem to be treating it as reasonable
and it's acting like you can sort men and women into neat little boxes and simplify all of gender relations into 'men and women don't like each other very much' and you don't have to 'reach' to find that objectionable
I definitely dont think that it would solve anyone's problems either! and I dont think that is what he is saying!
When I read that paragraph, I very much saw that catperson thing, not as a serious suggestion, but as an exaggeration to make a point about how male and female people are socialized away from one another rather than towards one another, he is presenting a ludicrous and bad final conclusion to that train of social organization that is blatantly objectionable to show that it is not good.
I'm not saying that that chunk of text does not have big problems, it oversimplifies, it ignores a lot of the grey areas in how gender and sex and society and all that stuff work, but as a thesis goes "men and women are made to dislike and misunderstand one another by society more than they should be, and we are worse off for it", seems like a good thing to be saying.
i don't think men and women are all that different, for the most part
and it bothers me a lot when people act like they are
it bothers me more than it probably should, admittedly, this has been a big thing for me as i'm sure you noticed, but it does, and i don't think i'm wrong in being bothered by it
i feel like the genders are a set of mostly superficial categories, and while they can cause real and serious social problems, the men and women themselves aren't really so different, at least not more so than men and men, or women and women
but as a thesis goes "men and women are made to dislike and misunderstand one another by society more than they should be, and we are worse off for it", seems like a good thing to be saying.
yes but this is a much less overblown claim than the one he appeared to be making
or maybe i'm just tired
it occurs to me that i've probably taken this more literally than i should, yet again; it sounds ridiculous because it's supposed to sound ridiculous, i guess
but if you think i'm reaching, well, no, i'm not reaching
i don't think segregation of the sexes would solve anyone's problems and i don't think many people would go for it
i find that post very weird, frankly, weird enough that i'm confused that we seem to be treating it as reasonable
and it's acting like you can sort men and women into neat little boxes and simplify all of gender relations into 'men and women don't like each other very much' and you don't have to 'reach' to find that objectionable
I definitely dont think that it would solve anyone's problems either! and I dont think that is what he is saying!
When I read that paragraph, I very much saw that catperson thing, not as a serious suggestion, but as an exaggeration to make a point about how male and female people are socialized away from one another rather than towards one another, he is presenting a ludicrous and bad final conclusion to that train of social organization that is blatantly objectionable to show that it is not good.
I'm not saying that that chunk of text does not have big problems, it oversimplifies, it ignores a lot of the grey areas in how gender and sex and society and all that stuff work, but as a thesis goes "men and women are made to dislike and misunderstand one another by society more than they should be, and we are worse off for it", seems like a good thing to be saying.
I didn't get any tone of exaggeration from it.
Maybe that's me.
But when you end a paragraph with "and I think that's quite sad" I generally assume you're being entirely serious.
To put it another way, what you are saying is reasonable, but I don't think he's saying what you're saying, nor what you think he's saying.
Truth be told, it's less an objective fact and more of a personalized observation, which in itself it just flawed enough to only ring true if you happen to make the same connections and equations as writer of the paragraph.
There are points of data to which this could apply to, that's just a testament to it's use of vague language however.
Truth be told, it's less an objective fact and more of a personalized observation, which in itself it just flawed enough to only ring true if you happen to make the same connections and equations as writer of the paragraph.
There are points of data to which this could apply to, that's just a testament to it's use of vague language however.
I firmly believe my interpretation of that stupid Yudowsky thing to be sound. I think you are all wrong, and I trust myself far more than I trust anyone else when it comes to the interpretation of things written by people.
You are the end result of a “would you push the button” prompt where the prompt was “you have unlimited godlike powers but you appear to all and sundry to be an impetuous child” – Zero, 2022
You are the end result of a “would you push the button” prompt where the prompt was “you have unlimited godlike powers but you appear to all and sundry to be an impetuous child” – Zero, 2022
Man is a most complex simple creature: see what he weaves, and how base his reasons for doing so.
Rock music expects, if it does not require, that the viewer/listener be intimately involved in the hypermediacy - that she "abandon herself" to the music. This abandonment is all the more threatening because there is nothing offered beyond the medium - no world into which the user can enter - as there is in conventional representational media, such as linear-perspective painting. What rock music seems to offer (and indeed what Wagnerian opera offered to the nineteenth century German audiences, or flute music in the Lydian mode to Plato's Greeks) is pure experience, pure authenticity, real in a sense that the listener's perception cannot itself be deceived.
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he made it sound like he thought the total segregation of the sexes was a plausible scenario and that the human race would be happier under those circumstances than now
. . . i feel like i'm stating the obvious here which makes me unsure whether i'm missing the point
i thought you were ignoring how offensive it is because it has robot catpeople lol we're so flippant here on HH
but do you actually think that paragraph is OK? because like
just what?
but if you think i'm reaching, well, no, i'm not reaching
i don't think segregation of the sexes would solve anyone's problems and i don't think many people would go for it
i find that post very weird, frankly, weird enough that i'm confused that we seem to be treating it as reasonable
and it's acting like you can sort men and women into neat little boxes and simplify all of gender relations into 'men and women don't like each other very much' and you don't have to 'reach' to find that objectionable
and it bothers me a lot when people act like they are
it bothers me more than it probably should, admittedly, this has been a big thing for me as i'm sure you noticed, but it does, and i don't think i'm wrong in being bothered by it
i feel like the genders are a set of mostly superficial categories, and while they can cause real and serious social problems, the men and women themselves aren't really so different, at least not more so than men and men, or women and women
yes but this is a much less overblown claim than the one he appeared to be making
or maybe i'm just tired
it occurs to me that i've probably taken this more literally than i should, yet again; it sounds ridiculous because it's supposed to sound ridiculous, i guess
Maybe that's me.
i don't know, i think you're better than me at interpreting stuff, generally
so probably you're right
but that was not how i read the post
well
thanks
sorry about before
that probably coloured my reading, i guess
i think now that maybe i found it funny for reasons i wasn't supposed to
i remember the Madam Malkins scene amused me, at least
at least as an abstract concept
I am a sucker for goofy super future technology though
tbh i was really quite angry back there, but i had no reason to be
transhumanism attracted me once but i have long since soured on it
like i wouldn't completely write it off as meritless or inherently absurd, but it mostly seems kind of aloof and unrealistic