why lord of the rings sucks

glennmagusharvey

i have only seen the three lotr films but that qualifies me to make sweeping judgements about the entire series of stories set in middle earth

here we go

the story is boring

the towers are interesting

the names "sauron" and "saruman" are too similar and confusing

the hobbits are hard to tell apart

boromir and aragorn are boring and hard to tell apart

the politics of the setting was badly presented

the story failed to really make me emotionally invested in anything and seemed to be mostly spectacle and drama rather than heartfelt sincerity

Justice4243

The last point might just mean you're a robot.

Fossilmaiden

Justice42 said:

The last point might just mean you're a robot.

You only just figured that out?

Justice4243

Also, it helps to remember that Aragorn is actually the devil pretending to be good.

glennmagusharvey

No it just means that I couldn't figure out why I should care about them other than from a tactical or mission-accomplishing standpoint.

I appreciated that getting the dead to fight for the good guys was cool.  I appreciated that a woman killing the Witch-King of Angmar was cool.  I understood that the goal was to dodge all the shit that Sauron would throw at the good guys and drop the ring into the fires of Mt. Doom.  I appreciated the awesome towers that were cinematically presented.  Stuff like that.

But it didn't get me to care emotionally.  It just felt like stuff was happening.  I didn't cry to anything.  I didn't cheer or feel a great sense of satisfaction at any particular moment (not that I remember at least).  I didn't really get feels out of it.

I think part of the reason was that I had trouble figuring out who was who.  As I mentioned, it took me a while to differentiate the hobbit-kids, or Aragorn vs. Boromir.

Obā-san

glennmagusharvey said:

No it just means that I couldn't figure out why I should care about them other than from a tactical or mission-accomplishing standpoint.

I appreciated that getting the dead to fight for the good guys was cool.  I appreciated that a woman killing the Witch-King of Angmar was cool.  I understood that the goal was to dodge all the shit that Sauron would throw at the good guys and drop the ring into the fires of Mt. Doom.  I appreciated the awesome towers that were cinematically presented.  Stuff like that.

But it didn't get me to care emotionally.  It just felt like stuff was happening.  I didn't cry to anything.  I didn't cheer or feel a great sense of satisfaction at any particular moment (not that I remember at least).  I didn't really get feels out of it.

this is how i felt to regarding the films at least

i was not a fan of them

Obā-san

also i have noticed that people on the internet do seem to put a lot of emphasis on how pieces of media make them feel

Justice4243

I haven't read the books either, but I got a very different feeling from it. I think about the only thing I can agree on are:

the names "sauron" and "saruman" are too similar and confusing

the politics of the setting was badly presented

glennmagusharvey

NAAAGHHH

YOU"RE NOT SUPPOSD TO AGREE WITH ME

I"M SUPPOSED TO BE THE ONLY PERSON FLAILING ON ONE SIDE OF THE ROOM WHILE NO ONE ELSE AGREES WITH ME BECAUS I"M ARGUING SO BADLY

Justice4243

also i have noticed that people on the internet do seem to put a lot of emphasis on how pieces of media make them feel

Isn't evoking some sort of response a pretty accepted sign that something is good or at least well made?

You know, assuming it was what the creators intended... I don't think it counts if one thought Requiem for a Dream was a laugh riot. 

Justice4243

glennmagusharvey said:

NAAAGHHH

YOU"RE NOT SUPPOSD TO AGREE WITH ME

I"M SUPPOSED TO BE THE ONLY PERSON FLAILING ON ONE SIDE OF THE ROOM WHILE NO ONE ELSE AGREES WITH ME BECAUS I"M ARGUING SO BADLY

You kinda of put a big "This is just, like, my opinion man" disclaimer over the OP.

glennmagusharvey

> also i have noticed that people on the internet do seem to put a lot of emphasis on how pieces of media make them feel

Well, from my experience, the literature, movies/TV shows/cartoons, web toons, music, videogames, etc. that are the most memorable are the ones that have had an emotional impact on me.  And I know I generally best remember those moments in their narratives with the greatest emotional impact.

Of course, that doesn't mean that one can construct a feels experience without proper use of setting, characterization, scripting, dramatic pacing, etc..  Those are all the pieces that have to be put into place to create a fully organic experience in which feels can be conjured, by immersing the audience in the context and making them feel like the story is happening to them (or to people they care about).

^ I'm aware that this is sort of a joke anyway and that's why I wrote that.  I mean, I'm perfectly aware that I'm spouting opinions that are unpopular and ill-informed and can't hold their own against a paper bag.  I'm just doing this for fun.  Of course, if this spawns a more serious discussion, I'm fine with that too.

Obā-san

IMO if something manages to evoke a strong emotional response that means it is at least decent, but good is not the same thing as decent really

Justice4243

The movies definitely clicked for me. 

I don't think they're flawless representations of the book. As mentioned, there's elements of Gimli's and Legolas's friendship I don't believe the film fully captured.

Also, Peter Jackson or, also very likely, one or both the women who helped write the screenplay gave elves and Legolas much more attention than they deserved and often relegated Gimli to comic relief, which really bugged me.

glennmagusharvey

Yeah, pretty much every conversation I've had with someone who has (or claimed to have) read the books says the books are better.

Re Gimli -- is there any version/incarnation of a Tolkienesque fantasy world that doesn't stereotype the races horribly?

Imipolex G

I, personally, have read the books but not seen the movies.

Which means that I am more Tolkien than thou

Justice4243

D&D is a pretty respectful treatment of the races, but of course they have the liberty of all the books to devote to being respectful. 

But yeah, most movies, TV shows, games tend to just use the stereotypes in lue of any depth.

Though, some games play this laughs pretty well, E.G Small World and Munchkins. 

Justice4243

Dirty Pillows said:

I, personally, have read the books but not seen the movies.

Which means that I am more Tolkien than thou

I'M GONNA READ THE SILMARILLION, THEN I WILL HAVE THE LARGEST TOLKIEN PENIS!

Previous Calica

aondeug probably has the biggest Tolkien cock, really.

Imipolex G

I read The Silmarillion too.

You will need to read Unfinished Tales as well if you are going to challenge my Tolkien phallus

Miss Miko Mayonegg

^^ Indeed because she is cool like that. :)

I read The Fellowship of the Ring several times and I think it is great. I read the better part of The Two Towers one time as well but I didn't finish the saga for some reason; perhaps I will sometime. Anyway, the movie versions are cool but they indeed lack a lot of the characterization in the books, and Legolas and Gimli do indeed have a nice friendship that is only really glimpsed in the films. Also, the dreamlike Tom Bombadil episode seems to have been omitted entirely, which disappointed me. :/

Obā-san

Miko said:

Tom Bombadil episode seems to have been omitted entirely, which disappointed me. :/

well at least Dom Bombadil shows up in the porn parody

Miss Miko Mayonegg

XD

Justice4243

I don't think Tom Bombadil would have translated well to the films.

Unless they extended them beyond the already massive amount of time each film is.

Mr. Darcy

Pangur Bán said:

Miko said:

Tom Bombadil episode seems to have been omitted entirely, which disappointed me. :/

well at least Dom Bombadil shows up in the porn parody

Ring a dong dillo! Bring a long dildo!

One-Winged Eagle

That's horrible.

Really though the thing about Lord of the Rings is that I appreciated it for what it was, what it was meant to be. It was one man's homage to the things he loved most of all in the world.

I recognized the language aspects and cultural themes and storytelling themes that Tolkien was trying to draw on, and that made me feel good.

Imipolex G

It was one man's homage to the things he loved most of all in the world.

This is a thing I can respect.

I also found, much to my pleasure, that Tolkien's work has a fixation on time and things vanishing into the past. Don't know if that came through in the movies...

Justice4243

I think the underlining theme is there. The elves leaving and Saruman's focus on industry destroying the forest are done pretty well.

Imipolex G

Groovy.

Salix Babylonika

spinor said:

aondeug probably has the biggest Tolkien cock, really.

actual fact.

Aliroz

I like Lord Of The Rings.

Imipolex G

So do I.

Aliroz

I mean, I actually sincerely like them a lot.

Justice4243

Books, movies or both.

I really liked the movies honestly. Friday does too.

Though she prefers the theater versions to the extended.

Salix Babylonika

I recall decently liking the movies the last time I saw them but that was a long time ago. I've never read the books, though I have read and enjoyed The Hobbit.

Yarrun XIX

Liked the Hobbit and the LOTR series. Haven't fully seen the movies. Only the Unexpected Journey, which I didn't like because it felt like fan-pandering rather than a concrete movie.

Odradek

Klinotaxis

still laughing at Pony

glennmagusharvey

same here

Imipolex G

the pony's name was Bill

Justice4243

Pony is not very lucky or willful.

MetaFour

The mines of Moria are no place for a pony.

Mr. Darcy

So I actually bought a copy of the Silmarillion, because it was illustrated with 50 paintings.

I'm still trying to make my way through it, with its grammatical tics like Tolkien's inability to say "none" or "no one" without adding the clause "save X only."

Miss Miko Mayonegg

I remember Bill the pony. I felt bad for him. :(

Imipolex G

Bill the pony turned out OK

I read the Silmarillion in an original hardcover that my aunt owns. It was pretty badass-looking. I thought.

Imipolex G

also I do not know how to do spoilers

Justice4243

The spoiler tags work about 50% of the time, anyhow.

Imipolex G

hmph