Look, whenever someone says "I blame the video games!" or a variation thereof, I am intensely skeptical. Mostly because in the rare event that a video game is involved, it tends to be less "this game/movie/whateverthefuck was so horrible it caused this man to go on a shooting rampage" and more "this was an intensely disturbed individual who probably would have gone on one regardless, also he played video games".
i get so angry sometimes i just punch plankton --Klinotaxis
Agree echoing a number of statements here.
This is tragic, no doubt. But, while Popular and violent, the Batman Franchise isn't exactly pioneering new ground and either. If popular, violent movie franchises where some sort of direct causation for violence, this sort of stuff would be more common place.
The fact that it ISN'T common at all is what I think a lot of the commotion is about, but people need to calm down about this and not do stuff like deny people the opportunity to (safely) enjoy the show as they which or cancel premiers outright.
That aside, I find it interesting that he would model himself after the Joker. Ledger's portrayal is certainly one of the most interesting and engaging characters Hollywood as served up in a good long while, but the Joker is almost certainly the least relatable or sympathetic character of the movie trilogy. Which might just show how off his rocker this guy is.
You are the end result of a “would you push the button” prompt where the prompt was “you have unlimited godlike powers but you appear to all and sundry to be an impetuous child” – Zero, 2022
I'm fairly sure the Joker thing turned out not to be true. It was one of a bunch of rumors that arose during the initial commotion.
i get so angry sometimes i just punch plankton --Klinotaxis
I can understand the confusion for Bane, but I assumed it was a REAL gas mask. Bane's mask would help much against smoke in the eyes, at the very least.
You are the end result of a “would you push the button” prompt where the prompt was “you have unlimited godlike powers but you appear to all and sundry to be an impetuous child” – Zero, 2022
Oh, that reminds me: I kept hearing conflicting reports that he used tear gas or smoke bombs. Does anyone know which one turned out to be true?
i get so angry sometimes i just punch plankton --Klinotaxis
Given some of the interviews, I bet they where gas canisters designed to make smoke.
Forsythe's description of what tear gas does makes me think that people would be in more pain and have a harder time escaping then they did. Many thought it was just a prank or "special effect" someone was doing as part of the show, I doubt gagging on the smoke would have a similar effect.
Also, given that (if I'm not mistaken) the body armor, gas mask, and fire-arms would be relatively easy to get (even by legal means), I doubt tear gas would be easy to acquire.
Doctor Who reference in Pokemon B2W2? Headcanon accepted.
You can get those items by shopping around at milsurp, but I figured them to be relatively uncommon. So much for that theory. Tear gas isn't so much pain as it is an incapacitating irritant, which it does very, very well -- so if all he had was smoke, then the crowded theater part did the rest.
Very important CNN blogger here already assuming the worst for himself and his little cadre of comic book nerd friends.
But as a nerd and CNN's resident expert on geeky subcultures, I readied myself for pointed questions which I expected to get from outside the geek community: "Why 'Batman'?" "Is the shooter a nerd?" "Why is it always the loner?"
Now my gut tells me comic book fans and movie geeks might face closer scrutiny even though there's no evidence the alleged shooter was either.
That's right, buddy, get that persecution complex running. Nevermind the fact that the average American
1. is not going to put you under the microscope or
2. fear you (hahahah are you fucking kidding me),
what the public is going to do is brace for the fact that this massacre is going to be overanalyzed and blame thrown everywhere for at least the next 12 months.
We nerds are also considered "not normal" by our peers, and are often stereotyped as socially awkward. Many of us are, indeed, awkward. And it's not unusual for highly intelligent people to have emotional problems.
Taking advantage of the tragedy to give himself a reacharound to go with that persecution complex, too. Wow. And final newsflash, this whole "geek" and "nerd" thing is not as uncommon as this douche wants to pretend it to be, as his very job should have informed him of.
Damn, I want to punch this guy in his fucking face.
I read on IMDB that the shooting lasted 6 months. Why didn't they just leave the theater?
Let me just copy what I told Country Pumpkin on IJBM2, I don't feel like typing this twice.
Do you have any idea how profoundly unfunny you're being right now?
This is like, the opposite of humor. The polar opposite. If Dave Chapelle was standing in the same room as you when you said this, he'd turn into an accountant.
I love how for some goddamn reason it's perfectly acceptable to make jokes about tragedies the day after they happen now, and everyone expects a chuckle at their dark and edgy humor. You're not funny. Stop trying to be.
In short, this kind of "ooh look! I can make fun of people who died horribly this morning!" is not funny, and it's not going to be funny any time soon. Neither from you nor from the eight million jackasses on my Facebook page who think it is.
If you knew one of the victims, then I'm sorry. Your loss is hard enough for you to bear without people joking about it.
If you don't, then I don't care. I don't care about the shooting, your self-righteousness, the candlelight vigils, the inevitable debates about gun control, how well the police responded, geek persecution and video games, or the laws that will be eventually be passed in response to the shooting . It is impossible, except in an intellectual sort of way, to truly care about the deaths of people I have never seen or talked to, and the same applies to you. The odds that anyone involved with the victims will see this conversation is a rounding error away from zero. I will make all the jokes about this I want.
I read on IMDB that the shooting lasted 6 months. Why didn't they just leave the theater?
Let me just copy what I told Country Pumpkin on IJBM2, I don't feel like typing this twice.
Do you have any idea how profoundly unfunny you're being right now?
This is like, the opposite of humor. The polar opposite. If Dave Chapelle was standing in the same room as you when you said this, he'd turn into an accountant.
I love how for some goddamn reason it's perfectly acceptable to make jokes about tragedies the day after they happen now, and everyone expects a chuckle at their dark and edgy humor. You're not funny. Stop trying to be.
In short, this kind of "ooh look! I can make fun of people who died horribly this morning!" is not funny, and it's not going to be funny any time soon. Neither from you nor from the eight million jackasses on my Facebook page who think it is.
If you knew one of the victims, then I'm sorry. Your loss is hard enough for you to bear without people joking about it.
If you don't, then I don't care. I don't care about the shooting, your self-righteousness, the candlelight vigils, the inevitable debates about gun control, how well the police responded, geek persecution and video games, or the laws that will be eventually be passed in response to the shooting . It is impossible, except in an intellectual sort of way, to truly care about the deaths of people I have never seen or talked to, and the same applies to you. The odds that anyone involved with the victims will see this conversation is a rounding error away from zero. I will make all the jokes about this I want.
inkblot, I'm going to be honest with you. You look like a freakin' douche bag.
I kindly suggest you keep it to the topic at hand and keep jokes about the shooting to yourself. We can't help that you don't feel any impact over this, but that doesn't give you license to ham it up over a tragic shooting.
"It is a matter of grave importance that Fairy tales should be respected.... Whosoever alters them to suit his own opinions, whatever they are, is guilty, to our thinking, of an act of presumption, and appropriates to himself what does not belong to him." -- Charles Dickens
It is impossible, except in an intellectual sort of way, to truly care about the deaths of people I have never seen or talked to, and the same applies to you. The odds that anyone involved with the victims will see this conversation is a rounding error away from zero. I will make all the jokes about this I want.
Inkblot, the massacre took place at Leigh Sabio's hometown mall. She worked at the JC Penney before moving to Oregon. We're grateful that none of the coworkers she made friends with were seeing DKR after work, nor was her younger sister or any of her friends. No, you will not make all the jokes about this you want.
Going back to the topic of video games = violence. It just reminds me of the stupidity of every sentence that ends "causes cancer", because most of what you're looking at are a bunch of coincidental statistics based on a fractional percentage of the group in topic. All said statements cause is fear and bias. There are many reasons people commit crimes. Exposure to violent video games/media does not represent the majority of those criminals nor does it explain the extent of their crimes. Hell, people who have traumatic backgrounds, are victims of abuse or have a lack of male role model as a youth are far more likely to commit a crime as adults than a person who plays violent video games. Over-activity in the frontal cortex of the brain is more likely to cause aggressive behaviour which in turn can lead to crimes, again, far more likely to be a cause than the media. You know what? Maybe if we spent less time bitching about what/who is to blame we can spend more time and resources fixing the factors that are definitely linked to crime and dysfunctional behaviour within our own society before we look to blame it on others.
And an on the note of people thinking that these crimes are funny and can be joked about, they're not, they're really not. Seriously. I cannot express how terrible any jokes on this are. People died. Like, seriously, people died. Not cool dudes, not cool. Whether they're someone you know or not, they mean something to someone, and to that person your jokes are painful and hurtful. Have some civility and respect for your fellow man.
Doctor Who reference in Pokemon B2W2? Headcanon accepted.
One Friday my sergeant asked me to take care of a duty for him regarding the base theater on a saturday morning, and opening it for a fellow giving a presentation to a company of infantry. Said fellow was Lt. Col Grossman (US Army) who was one of the folks who raised the alarm along with Thompson and coined the term "Murder Simulator" for certain video games. What the Wiki article does not go into is the fact that his expertise in his chosen field now called "killology" is first-hand. In Vietnam, he was a bad motherfucker in every sense of the word. Not a showoff or anything, he was just very very good at being a US Army Ranger. His explanation of how he handled it at the current time and his life afterwards was like is pretty much the same way GySgt Carlos Hathcock (US Marine sniper in Vietnam) assessed it: It's nothing personal, it has to be done. Anyway, Grossman lectures the military on this ability to turn on this kind of apathy. Chilling stuff I know, but it's from his experience in this field -- which is arguably second to none -- that causes him to raise the alarm about violent video games.
Anyway that was a fun morning because at first the audio in the entire theater decided to take a vacation and I had to get something working, which running to the PX across the street and some 9 volt batteries later fixed. Afterward, I got to spend time with Lt Col Grossman and ask him about all these questions that gamers raise about his assessments and his relationship to Jack Thompson. Grossman explained that he has nothing against video games or violent video games, and that he even enjoys some of them. He just thinks that impressionable children and teens have no business playing them, which I agree with. As for Thompson, at the time he said that what he's doing is a good thing. I don't know if he still holds that opinion. This was late 2007, by the way. I know that Lt Col Grossman's phone is probably ringing off the hook at this moment, and I'm interested in hearing what he has to say. By the way, he is a very, very nice man who gave me a signed copy of every book he wrote and bought me lunch.
Anyway, as far as jokes and the like go, I can crack a joke and laugh about them regarding any situation at any time. However, I also know that most other people don't share that attitude, especially when you're on their turf or in their home. If they keep complaining about your idea of humor, you should turn it off and share it somewhere it is.
Anyway, as far as jokes and the like go, I can crack a joke and laugh about them regarding any situation at any time. However, I also know that most other people don't share that attitude, especially when you're on their turf or in their home. If they keep complaining about your idea of humor, you should turn it off and share it somewhere it is.
Hence why I haven't made another one. Wasn't sure how you guys would deal with that, tried it, found out that this forum is one of the ones where I should keep it to myself
Her* fears would probably have been justified ten or twenty years ago, but now, in the age of the blockbuster superhero movie? Not so much. Too many people can appreciate the value in comics to dismiss all comics fans as crazy and dangerous.
Funny that she didn't bring up the Tsutomu Miyazaki case. Despite the differences in American and Japanese culture, that media panic is a much more convincing example of an entire subculture being marginalised by the horrifying behaviours of an individual than the Columbine shootings.
*Yes, the author is a woman. Ann Hoevel. A bit unexpected, that.
Yeah, what Sredni said. The world has changed a lot since 1999; internet fandoms are no longer The New Rock and Roll, comic-book movies are getting nominated for Best Picture (and SDCC is as important as the Red Carpet), and "murder simulators" have been replaced with (at least marginally) classier games with either actual combat themes or cartoony violence. I doubt anyone's going to persecute her for being a geek when geeks have it better now than they ever have.
Doctor Who reference in Pokemon B2W2? Headcanon accepted.
Oh, I'm sure Micheal Moore's fat chops are just quivering at this one. But you're right, at least for this one they probably won't call in Marilyn Manson as an expert.
Doctor Who reference in Pokemon B2W2? Headcanon accepted.
Friend of mine just posted this on Facebook:
Guys, here's the thing, or several things:
1) The whole "if we ban X or had banned X, the tragedy would have been prevented or appreciably less likely" reasoning is flawed. While the gun control debate is orders of magnitude bigger than can be debated here, just consider if X = bombs. Bombs're already banned yet it didn't stop the guy from wiring his apt to blow up his entire building and partsof the neighboring ones. Had he not voluntarily warned the police about his apartment, they would've been much more likely to set the thing off. The guy was intelligent, methodical, disciplined, premeditated, and determined. He seems to have acquired all his guns legally according to the waiting periods and so forth.
2) The whole reasoning that "if the general population was regularly armed with their own guns, the tragedy would have been prevented or contained" reasoning is also flawed. The guy dressed himself head-to-toe in ballistic armor, including vulnerable areas like neck and joints. Unless people are armed with rocket launchers or grenades, he would've been just as capable of killing and injuring the same number of people.
It's hard for me to see how either more guns or less would have made much of a difference.
Really, everything about the guy is a laundry list of Xs, the banning of which, if you really think about it, wouldn't have prevented the tragedy at all.
He was smart. He was highly educated. He had a masters and was a PhD student before withdrawing. Do you believe banning graduate schools or Masters/PhD programs would make a difference?
He was inspired by a movie about a psychotic comic book character. Do you believe banning movies or comics would make a difference?
AMC did that meaningless ban on moviegoers attending in costume, but the guy was dressed regularly and when he armored up, it wasn't a costume.
As far as I can see, no amount of banning different Xs would have stopped this. I even have to wonder if that might not have been part of his intent in all this, as it seems to be in so many other cases: to not only demonstrate that none of these bring the security people think they do, but to deliberately and viscerally rob them of their delusions. I presume it's part of his intent to continue instilling fear in people long after the incident by this realization.
Doctor Who reference in Pokemon B2W2? Headcanon accepted.
I stand corrected:
The gunman's semiautomatic assault rifle jammed during the attack at the Aurora movie theater, forcing him to switch to another gun with less firepower, a federal law enforcement official told The Associated Press. That malfunction and weapons switch during the shooting rampage might have saved some lives.
Oates said a 100-round ammunition drum was found in the theater but said he did not know whether it jammed or emptied.
It probably jammed, and probably due to that ridiculous aftermarket 100-round drum. Aside from weight, there's a reason the military limits itself to 30-round clips, and even then we never loaded our weapons with more than 20 rounds to prevent too much stress on the spring causing more jams.
Pretty much. All that "tactical" shit you see that gun owners "upgrade" their rifle with are added weight at best, prone to malfunction at worst. They also make you look like a fucking idiot.
You are the end result of a “would you push the button” prompt where the prompt was “you have unlimited godlike powers but you appear to all and sundry to be an impetuous child” – Zero, 2022
here's another one. one of the victims, Jessica Ghawi(Also known as Jessica Redfield professionally) had actually survived a shot-out just a month ago :(
"I was shown how fragile life was on Saturday. I saw the terror on bystanders’ faces. I saw the victims of a senseless crime. I saw lives change. I was reminded that we don’t know when or where our time on Earth will end. When or where we will breathe our last breath."
Wow. That just brought the horror to an entirely new level.
Cross-posting my thoughts from IJBM:
This whole situation is... really, there are no words.
I get this weird, awful feeling that the USA is slowly turning into what Italy was like in the '70s and '80s, but with all the positive aspects (the "occupation" of Bologna, Radio Alice) excised in favour of more senseless bloodshed.
Someone, please, tell me something life-affirming, or at least reassuring. I'm really down right now, and this...
Comments
i get so angry sometimes i just punch plankton --Klinotaxis
i get so angry sometimes i just punch plankton --Klinotaxis
i get so angry sometimes i just punch plankton --Klinotaxis
But as a nerd and CNN's resident expert on geeky subcultures, I readied myself for pointed questions which I expected to get from outside the geek community: "Why 'Batman'?" "Is the shooter a nerd?" "Why is it always the loner?"
Now my gut tells me comic book fans and movie geeks might face closer scrutiny even though there's no evidence the alleged shooter was either.In short, this kind of "ooh look! I can make fun of people who died horribly this morning!" is not funny, and it's not going to be funny any time soon. Neither from you nor from the eight million jackasses on my Facebook page who think it is.
If you knew one of the victims, then I'm sorry. Your loss is hard enough for you to bear without people joking about it.If you don't, then I don't care. I don't care about the shooting, your self-righteousness, the candlelight vigils, the inevitable debates about gun control, how well the police responded, geek persecution and video games, or the laws that will be eventually be passed in response to the shooting . It is impossible, except in an intellectual sort of way, to truly care about the deaths of people I have never seen or talked to, and the same applies to you. The odds that anyone involved with the victims will see this conversation is a rounding error away from zero. I will make all the jokes about this I want.
But yeah.
i get so angry sometimes i just punch plankton --Klinotaxis
If you don't, then I don't care. I don't care about the shooting, your self-righteousness, the candlelight vigils, the inevitable debates about gun control, how well the police responded, geek persecution and video games, or the laws that will be eventually be passed in response to the shooting . It is impossible, except in an intellectual sort of way, to truly care about the deaths of people I have never seen or talked to, and the same applies to you. The odds that anyone involved with the victims will see this conversation is a rounding error away from zero. I will make all the jokes about this I want.
inkblot, I'm going to be honest with you. You look like a freakin' douche bag.
i get so angry sometimes i just punch plankton --Klinotaxis
i get so angry sometimes i just punch plankton --Klinotaxis
i get so angry sometimes i just punch plankton --Klinotaxis
Which is silly, the shooters preferred KMFDM, which is a far better band.
1) The whole "if we ban X or had banned X, the tragedy would have been prevented or appreciably less likely" reasoning is flawed. While the gun control debate is orders of magnitude bigger than can be debated here, just consider if X = bombs. Bombs're already banned yet it didn't stop the guy from wiring his apt to blow up his entire building and partsof the neighboring ones. Had he not voluntarily warned the police about his apartment, they would've been much more likely to set the thing off. The guy was intelligent, methodical, disciplined, premeditated, and determined. He seems to have acquired all his guns legally according to the waiting periods and so forth.
2) The whole reasoning that "if the general population was regularly armed with their own guns, the tragedy would have been prevented or contained" reasoning is also flawed. The guy dressed himself head-to-toe in ballistic armor, including vulnerable areas like neck and joints. Unless people are armed with rocket launchers or grenades, he would've been just as capable of killing and injuring the same number of people.
It's hard for me to see how either more guns or less would have made much of a difference.
Really, everything about the guy is a laundry list of Xs, the banning of which, if you really think about it, wouldn't have prevented the tragedy at all.
He was smart. He was highly educated. He had a masters and was a PhD student before withdrawing. Do you believe banning graduate schools or Masters/PhD programs would make a difference?
He was inspired by a movie about a psychotic comic book character. Do you believe banning movies or comics would make a difference?
AMC did that meaningless ban on moviegoers attending in costume, but the guy was dressed regularly and when he armored up, it wasn't a costume.
As far as I can see, no amount of banning different Xs would have stopped this. I even have to wonder if that might not have been part of his intent in all this, as it seems to be in so many other cases: to not only demonstrate that none of these bring the security people think they do, but to deliberately and viscerally rob them of their delusions. I presume it's part of his intent to continue instilling fear in people long after the incident by this realization.
Oates said a 100-round ammunition drum was found in the theater but said he did not know whether it jammed or emptied.
:(
God-dammit.
that's.....that's pretty fucking harsh.
Wow....
here's another one. one of the victims, Jessica Ghawi(Also known as Jessica Redfield professionally) had actually survived a shot-out just a month ago :(
http://jessicaredfield.wordpress.com/
"I was shown how fragile life was on Saturday. I saw the terror on
bystanders’ faces. I saw the victims of a senseless crime. I saw lives
change. I was reminded that we don’t know when or where our time on
Earth will end. When or where we will breathe our last breath."
on June 5, 2012
I wouldn't say "common".
Tends to happen, what, once or twice a decade?
That doesn't make it any less sad, but there you go.
The standard of living has consistently risen and the rate of crime consistently fallen in the past 30 years with no signs of the trend reversing.That's a problem with the legal system, though, and the affiliated prison system.
Not indicative of a trend regarding actual crimes being committed.