What is Art?

MissUtilis · 2015-04-13 09:28:32

I am currently deep in my glorified fanfic under the mask of Jill Hersheimer, and I fear that the shows she's worked on (101 Dalmatians: The Series, Cirque du Yogi, and Space Ghost (2016)) can never be Art. The trophy of Excellence will always be out of their reach.

So what does attain the trophy of Excellence and plaudits as Art?

One-Winged Eagle · 2015-04-13 09:38:08

Art is Maya: a shared delusion that we pretend means something.

But because it is shared, it is important.

Art is whatever we currently say it is. In fact, it is nothing BUT what we say it is.

Obā-san · 2015-04-13 14:30:42

art responds to other art

MissUtilis · 2015-04-13 18:38:16

I mean "Art", not "art"

PatchAwful · 2015-04-13 20:16:37

Baby don't hurt me

Don't hurt me

No Moore

sunn wolf · 2015-04-13 20:32:12

Miss Utilis said:
I mean "Art", not "art"

but Art is bullshit, and art is way better

sunn wolf · 2015-04-13 20:32:22

just imo ofcourse

glennmagusharvey · 2015-04-13 21:07:40

a miserable little pile of greater meaning

One-Winged Eagle · 2015-04-13 23:23:13

I suppose you're talking about "high art", which is a system of power and prestige meant to favor those who embody what the elite want to represent about their culture.

By nature, it is exclusionary.

Salix Babylonika · 2015-04-13 23:27:04

MachSpeed said:
a system of power and prestige meant to favor those who embody what the elite want to represent about their culture.

Salix Babylonika · 2015-04-13 23:27:21

Art is bullshit

art is cool

imo graffiti > almost all formal painting

Obā-san · 2015-04-13 23:47:10

One-Winged Eagle · 2015-04-13 23:49:54

I wish that image worked, because then it would have been hilarious.

Salix Babylonika · 2015-04-13 23:52:11

person that made the "broken image" thumbnail > Andy Warhol

Calica · 2015-04-13 23:54:11

Planet Jane said:
person that made the "broken image" thumbnail > Andy Warhol

nah

Calica · 2015-04-13 23:54:33

MissUtilis · 2015-04-13 23:55:22

Planet Jane said:
Art is bullshit

art is cool

imo graffiti > almost all formal painting

I'm one of those people who considers the early Hanna-Barbera backgrounds Art, and those are formal painting

MissUtilis · 2015-04-13 23:55:46

anyway I'm not talking about "high art", I am talking about things that are generally accepted as Art and/or win critical plaudits

Salix Babylonika · 2015-04-13 23:57:07

Miss Utilis said:

Planet Jane said:
Art is bullshit

art is cool

imo graffiti > almost all formal painting
I'm one of those people who considers the early Hanna-Barbera backgrounds Art, and those are formal painting

formal paintings hang on gallery walls.

I mean some HB backgrounds do, but only in like cartoon history museums, that's not what I meant.

MissUtilis · 2015-04-14 00:03:35

oh

my idea of Art seems to differ from yours

One-Winged Eagle · 2015-04-14 00:47:07

Miss Utilis said:
anyway I'm not talking about "high art", I am talking about things that are generally accepted as Art and/or win critical plaudits

Those are the same things, there's just different heights of it.

And then there's the gulf between the lowest of high art and just art.

MissUtilis · 2015-04-14 01:01:20

Art is influential. Art is important. To dust an old one off, Art has legitimacy.

MissUtilis · 2015-04-14 01:01:43

Art is not just some bullshit the elite pretend to enjoy so they can feel better than us

One-Winged Eagle · 2015-04-14 01:10:16

I actually don't feel like art is that important. I don't feel that it's as influential as we think it is.

Controlled empathy can only ever reach people at arm's length. It cannot make people change their minds.

It's good at some things, but it isn't a cure-all. It isn't a great weight that nobody can ignore.

MissUtilis · 2015-04-14 01:12:57

I'm more artsy than you are, so I don't completely agree...

lee4hmz · 2015-04-14 01:43:18

fuck compose fuck melody dedicated to no one thanks to no one ART IS OVER

Salix Babylonika · 2015-04-14 01:50:07

Art is influential. Art is important. To dust an old one off, Art has legitimacy.

Legitimacy, Influence, and Importance are all essentially units of cultural currency. Cultural currency always comes from the people in power and is given to those that either respect the establishment that made them or challenge the establishment in a way that is sure to not actually change anything.

So, yes, Art, at least in the sense that you're talking about is just some bullshit the elite pretend to enjoy so they can feel better than us.

Even if you were to buy into that whole line of rhetoric, what is considered legitimate, influential, and culturally important changes over time.

Compare the reaction to rock music when it was new (intelligence-damaging and potentially dangerous) to how it is viewed today (the default "best" supergenre of popular music), as an example.

Miss Utilis said:
I'm more artsy than you are, so I don't completely agree...

Kraken designs boardgames, how is that not an art (lowercase "A"), form?

Odradek · 2015-04-14 02:21:01

Well baby don't hurt me

don't hurt me

no more

Odradek · 2015-04-14 02:22:35

https://www.marxists.org/reference/subject/philosophy/works/ge/benjamin.htm

MissUtilis · 2015-04-14 02:27:36

I was unaware that Kraken designed boardgames

Also my obsession with "Art" comes at least in part from a Slate article that said exploitation films from the 1970s being considered such was thanks to the process of "Crap + 20 Years = Art"

MissUtilis · 2015-04-14 02:28:06

Also my mental image of Excellence is the "YOU'RE WINNER!" trophy from Big Rigs, so take that as you will

One-Winged Eagle · 2015-04-14 02:46:27

I don't do boardgames, I do tabletop roleplaying games. It's the difference between Monopoly and Champions. It's why I keep making roleplay threads that insist on using game systems.

I think it's not so much [CRAP] + 20[YEARS] = [ART] so much as it is that it took twenty years for the people who enjoyed exploitation films to come into power.

MissUtilis · 2015-04-14 03:16:17

that makes sense

glennmagusharvey · 2015-04-14 09:49:20

lee4hmz said:
fuck compose fuck melody dedicated to no one thanks to no one ART IS OVER

artgate lololololololololololol

it's about ethics in art criticism

sunn wolf · 2015-04-14 09:56:18

lee4hmz said:
fuck compose fuck melody dedicated to no one thanks to no one ART IS OVER

sunn wolf · 2015-04-14 09:56:39

Panurge said:
https://www.marxists.org/reference/subject/philosophy/works/ge/benjamin.htm

Obā-san · 2015-04-14 15:39:34

Planet Jane said:
person that made the "broken image" thumbnail > Andy Warhol

Bruce LaBruce said:
Warhol's influence has been destructive mostly because it's been misinterpreted. I can relate to him because he was tortured farmboy from nowhere, he was picked on, and he was a sissy. So that [identity] is part of the thrust behind his whole work. But for example, when he said "15 minutes famous," he didn't really mean it as a good thing. He meant it as a very detached way, like everyone will be a product from a factory that's slotted for this moment of fame, and everyone is just interchangeable—it's a dystopian vision. I mean, the truth is that he was incredibly morbid and detached. On him it looks good, but when you have super-rich artists trying to emulate his philosophy, they totally misunderstand it and it becomes a capitalist indulgence.

Princess Alice · 2015-04-14 20:32:16

Planet Jane said:
person that made the "broken image" thumbnail > Andy Warhol

Obligatory: http://www.underconsideration.com/brandnew/archives/google_chromes_broken_image_icon_heals_broken_hearts.php

What is Art?

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