The Landfill of the Heapers' Hangout (contains Fossilmaiden's Punnery)

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Comments

  • I've learned to tolerate drama...except on the boat
    Branded Saturday morning blocks on ABC in the years after Disney took over, and sold the network to what is now ABC Warner:
    • Disney's One Saturday Morning (September 13, 1997 - September 7, 2002)
    • ABC Kids (September 14, 2002 - August 27, 2011)
    • You Belong/The Hub on ABC (September 3, 2011 - December 27, 2014)
    • Kids' WB! on ABC (January 3, 2015 - present)
  • THIS MACHINE KILLS FASCISTS
    NO MOTORIZED VEHICLES

    PARK CLOSES AT DUSK
  • imagei will watch the heck outta this pumpkin patch
    a human population largely consisting of androgynous, gay hermaphrodites-in-the-non-offensive-biological-sense
  • edited 2015-09-10 03:41:13
       
       
  • Touch the cow. Do it now.
    a human population consisting mostly of manatees
  • imagei will watch the heck outta this pumpkin patch
    a human population consisting mostly of one really big human plus a few smaller ones
  • You are the end result of a “would you push the button” prompt where the prompt was “you have unlimited godlike powers but you appear to all and sundry to be an impetuous child” – Zero, 2022
    Tachyon said:

    a human population largely consisting of androgynous, gay hermaphrodites-in-the-non-offensive-biological-sense

    "intersex" is the preferred term
  • imagei will watch the heck outta this pumpkin patch
    That's not the same thing.
  • imagei will watch the heck outta this pumpkin patch
    well, i guess i wasn't very clear though

    'intersex' does not imply that a form of sexual reproduction where both testes and ovaries are present in both participants is the norm, as 'hermaphrodite' does when referring to non-human animals in a biological context
  • More people have said that and been killed than there are thorium decay products.
    I'm depressed
  • You are the end result of a “would you push the button” prompt where the prompt was “you have unlimited godlike powers but you appear to all and sundry to be an impetuous child” – Zero, 2022

    I'm depressed

    *Centie hug*
  • Munch munch, chomp chomp...
    I'm depressed
    Hugs
  • We can do anything if we do it together.

    I'm depressed

    *hugs*
  • More people have said that and been killed than there are thorium decay products.
    :)
  • Touch the cow. Do it now.

    I'm depressed

    me too *hug*
  • edited 2015-09-14 11:09:25
    More people have said that and been killed than there are thorium decay products.
    image
  • imagei will watch the heck outta this pumpkin patch
    walking bike!
  • imagei will watch the heck outta this pumpkin patch
    gifv doesn't embed i guess
  • Boss #0: Hyuuga
    Boss #1: Takao
    Boss #2: Haruna & Kirishima
    Boss #3: Maya
    Boss #4: I-400 & I-402
    Boss #5: Kongou
  • It's quite satisfying when plots have very good pacing of escalating drama.

    Arpeggio is one example.

    Neon Genesis Evangelion is another.

    Madoka Magica is not an example.
  • Does the story hold together and make sense even when you don't completely understand what happened?

    In the case of Evangelion, you can feel the intensity rising, especially in the latter half of the show.  It almost doesn't matter where the Angels come from, or what Gendo is up to.  You don't need to think about these things in order to feel that intensity.

    In Madoka Magica, you can't, and it's just more like going through a log of the events.  There is a lot to think about, but it is not motivated by feeling and emotion.

    That is a failing of Madoka Magica.
  • Contrast Final Fantasy: the Spirits Within.  Even though it doesn't completely flesh out its setting details, the storytelling and pacing allows the feel of drama to flow skillfully through the course of the story.

    That is why it is a better story than Madoka Magica.
  • edited 2015-09-15 07:48:54
    To be fair, part of that feel may very well be due to the music.  Kajiura's soundtrack for Madoka Magica is certainly not bad, but it felt somewhat compartmentalized -- though perhaps this may also be a fault of the storytelling method.  On the other hand, Arpeggio and N.G. Evangelion both have soundtracks that suggest a strong sense of grandeur, one that immerses the audience in something clearly of greater magnitude than themselves.

    The music isn't necessarily all of it, though, since FF:TSW had a mostly ambient soundtrack.  That said, to be fair, it also did contribute to a sense of grandeur.

    Madoka Magica, on the other hand, had about as much grandeur as a stiffly-written academic treatise on the themes of Shakespeare's plays.  It is intellectually interesting, but fails to be emotionally engaging for much of it, excepting some particularly noteworthy revelations that are moving and emotionally engaging in and of themselves.
  • Yes, I did just argue that FF:TSW has better storytelling than Madoka Magica.

    suck it, Urobuchi fans
  • edited 2015-09-15 07:49:47
    Still don't quite get why people dislike FF:TSW that much.

    The only reason I can come up with, after thinking about it a few times, is that the setting details aren't that fleshed out, and the movie begins in medias res.
  • But the fact that the setting details are not needed for something to be emotionally engaging means that -- assuming the quality of a story has a direct (rather than inverse) relationship with its emotional engagement, all other things being equal -- means that fleshing out the setting automatically make it a better story.

    In fact, there are many, many examples of narratives that don't provide all the details and leave various details unexplained, and are better for it.  They thrive off of the mystery of those unexplained elements.

    There is definitely an emotional satisfaction derived from a story challenging the audience's sense of "control" of their understanding of the world as presented to them.
  • Mysticism and the sense of wonder seems to be an element in religious belief, incidentally.

    For example, a Catholic priest recently explained to me that part of a proper relationship with God is appreciating the wonder the wondrous mysteries that God is associated with -- that we will never understand God fully but that sense of wonder is a part of the faith.
  • I think that some of my favorite stories cultivate and direct that sense of wonder very well.  The feeling of being in the presence of some greater force, whether sympathetic or antagonistic, and the dynamics of ability and/or inability to deal with it.

    In some cases, that greater force is a mysterious enemy.  In some cases, that greater force is a close ally.  In a few cases, that greater force turns out to be oneself.
  • I think that some of my favorite stories cultivate and direct that sense of wonder very well.  The feeling of being in the presence of some greater force, whether sympathetic or antagonistic, and the dynamics of ability and/or inability to deal with it.

    In some cases, that greater force is a mysterious enemy.  In some cases, that greater force is a close ally.  In a few cases, that greater force turns out to be oneself.

    Or maybe I'm just bullshitting.  I dunno.
  • edited 2015-09-15 08:06:22
    If you had the force to change the world, what would you do?

    If you had the force to right wrongs, to fight back, to even the playing field, to investigate wrongdoing, to correct injustices, ...what would you do?
  • edited 2015-09-15 08:11:58
    There are lots of details that Kiddy Grade does not tell us.

    However, those details that it does tell us are not disconnected -- they have what is much like a poetic meaning.

    For example, you don't need to be told exactly why Éclair was in prison at some point in time to understand why she was imprisoned and to make sense of what she says.
  • I bet that for some higher-ups she's seen as an opinionated, passion-driven, impulsive git.
  • Touch the cow. Do it now.
    A sense of wonder is a great thing to have.
  • Touch the cow. Do it now.
    A great thing indeed.
  • La-Mulana has that strong narrative progression, despite not being a story-centric game.  (It is very setting-centric though.)

    Mega Man ZX may have had a lot of "fodder" in the middle part of the game, but it is the fodder that made the beginning and end so very meaningful.  Again, meaningful narrative progression.

    Similarly, almost every boss is a challenge for Yunica, and progressively more and more so.  The last two bosses before the final boss are probably the most dramatic and climactic examples.  It's not even necessarily to completely sort out the story -- all that is really needed is to really feel first-hand the intense suffering of her struggling against these antagonistic forces.

    In fact, it may be said that that having a struggle just makes victory that much more satisfying.
  • La-Mulana also has that sense of wonder.

    (It literally has a track called "Wonder of the Wonder", lol.)

    Ys Origin does too.

    So does CvSotN, despite CvSotN lacking as good of a narrative experience progression (in part thanks to the relatively freeform -- and possibly unfinished -- second half).

    MMZX on the other hand doesn't have a sense of wonder as much as it has some other emotions.
  • Seriously, just thinking about how MMZX's final area theme reprises -- but with a different mood -- a very early-game event theme, brings me almost to tears.  It strongly evokes those emotions -- such as the feeling of having since learned the truth and now having the conviction of what one is fighting for, as well as the feeling of doing what one can to make it so that those who have died have not died in vain.
  • edited 2015-09-15 08:25:39
    I'm sorry, but wacky slapstick absurdist anime comedy just...doesn't do these things.

    It doesn't generate emotions like this.  It generates amusement, I guess.

    But it generates no realizations.  It generates no desires, no feelings of vengeance or anger, no feelings of sympathy or comfort, no feelings of triumph or bliss, no feelings of loss or defeat.

    Well okay it's occasionally used to generate feelings of comfort.  I guess.  Kinda.  But that's about it.
  • Touch the cow. Do it now.
    on the other hand, wacky slapstick absurdist anime comedy can do other things.
  • Wacky slapstick is gdlk. And totally better. :p
  • Of course, these feelings cannot be shoved onto the audience in short order.  They have to be generated by the audience themselves, in reaction to the events portrayed.  Asking someone to cry only makes them cry crocodile tears at best.

    Thus a lot of time some amount of "fodder" is needed, so to speak.  The term's implication that said "fodder" is unimportant and inconsequential is actually an incorrect implication -- it is precisely this "fodder" that allows one to familiarize oneself with the premises of the setting and the personalities and lives of the characters.  In order for emotional dynamics to occur, change has to happen, or be suggested and denied.  In order for change to be measurable, an initial state must first be determined.

    There is no rule stating that fodder must only be so much or so long.  As long as that fodder contributes to a good narrative experience, it has served its purpose.

    Remember that we as humans don't understand the value of something until we have lost it (or contemplate losing it).
  • TitleName said:

    Wacky slapstick is gdlk. And totally better. :p

    Wacky slapstick does not build a personal relationship with me.
  • edited 2015-09-15 08:34:51
    I was half joking. Half because I like comedy and half because I don't get half of what you talk about. 2deep4me.

    You have your own views on media but it is not necessarily superior. Nor is mine.
  • TitleName said:

    I was half joking. Half because I like comedy and half because I don't get half of what you talk about. 2deep4me.

    You have your own views on media but it is not necessarily superior. Nor is mine.

    Nah, don't worry, you're fine.  I'm just ranting anyway.
  • edited 2015-09-15 08:58:52

    Wacky slapstick does not build a personal relationship with me.

    Some people speak of having a "personal relationship" with God or with Jesus.

    In light of this, it is really not much of surprise that I find religious-like spiritual inspiration from my favorite stories.
  • I mean, people often find passages of religious texts "deeply moving".

    Well, they're stories, that -- when taken seriously -- can touch people's hearts.

    Same thing.
  • edited 2015-09-15 09:07:45
    Well I do have rather simple tastes. Leaning towards over the top because why not go the whole nine yards in insanity?

    I admit, a lot of these themes / emotional stuff I usually gloss over. Especially in games where I focus far more on gameplay.
  • edited 2015-09-15 09:18:18
    Maybe I just have an easier time connecting with humorous things than I do with serious stuff.

    Which is why I'll maintain GBA FFV as the superior version. What's wrong with having an RPG be goofy? I'd rather something not be afraid to have fun with itself than take itself seriously to a fault. It's simply my preference. That builds a personal relationship with me.
  • edited 2015-09-15 09:21:10
    Yeah, I'm like the opposite; I have little taste for over-the-top-ness but I'm very much into the emotional stuff.

    I've hypothesized that it's because I tend to appreciate stories more for how they relate to me and the world around me rather than for the distance I can put between me and others who are unlike me.

    Beyond that, I don't really know why.  Maybe it's because I didn't watch that many "craaaazy" kids' cartoons as a child, and/or I learned music / played games / watched TV / etc. with more direct/straightforward and often dramatic narratives.  Or somehow I learned to enjoy frankness and directness more than sarcasm or exaggeration.  Or for whatever reason I'm more of an idealist than the internet is on average.
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