Valuable Lessons

Anonus · 2013-05-10 19:48:27

This is an unpublished book about TV (and occasional film) writer Andrew Nicholls's experiences through the years, up to 2005.

It is, for me, another one of those things that make me wonder why I am interested in the entertainment business, or even business in general, and it makes me feel guilty for enjoying the products of Hollywood...

Section42L · 2013-05-10 20:10:20

As the person who showed Anonus this book, I'm obliged to post in this thread.

Yeah, that book is pretty damn scary in places. It's always a bit disturbing to see how the sausage really gets made.

Anonus · 2013-05-10 20:20:25

I admit, as soul-crushing as that book is, I was kind of hoping he'd worked on Shasta McNasty. I kind of want to know what it was like behind the scenes of that show...it's so unbelievably bad...

Section42L · 2013-05-10 20:25:26

I don't blame you for hoping he worked on that show. After all, it seems like he's worked on every other awful show that was hatched out of a pre-existing property and/or a television executive's brain during his career.

Anonus · 2013-05-10 20:30:11

The guy who created Shasta, Jeff Eastin, wasn't an exec; he went on to do White Collar for USA, which I suppose is a good postscript for him.

I just hope everybody else was able to make off alright...I can't imagine anyone actually liked working on that shit.

Anonus · 2013-05-10 20:37:52

Also:

Andrew Nicholls said:
Mary Harrington at Nickelodeon watched the clip, took in the entire
pitch, then took a deep breath and asked, “Why... would a boy want a pet?”
Now, I don’t mind if you want to pass on a show – if you don’t like
the idea or the drawings, if you don’t have room on the schedule, or if it
doesn’t work well alongside your other ouevres. But don’t make people
who’ve driven across town to see you jump through hoops to answer stupid
questions, their fumbling at which you can then pretend forms the rationale
behind your rejection. Jesus. Why would a boy want a pet? “Why would
anyone not want to eat a lump of shit?” This is really Stalin asking, “Is
everybody happy?” There’s nothing you can say to it. “What, are you
nuts?”

I can't get over how stupid this is. Do these people ever override their need to feel important by acknowledging that someone has a solid idea?

Sredni Vashtar · 2013-05-10 20:41:46

A strange anecdote, given that Harrington oversaw some pretty interesting shows in her time...

Salix Babylonika · 2013-05-10 20:44:47

Anonus said:
Also:
Andrew Nicholls said:
Mary Harrington at Nickelodeon watched the clip, took in the entire
pitch, then took a deep breath and asked, “Why... would a boy want a pet?”
Now, I don’t mind if you want to pass on a show – if you don’t like
the idea or the drawings, if you don’t have room on the schedule, or if it
doesn’t work well alongside your other ouevres. But don’t make people
who’ve driven across town to see you jump through hoops to answer stupid
questions, their fumbling at which you can then pretend forms the rationale
behind your rejection. Jesus. Why would a boy want a pet? “Why would
anyone not want to eat a lump of shit?” This is really Stalin asking, “Is
everybody happy?” There’s nothing you can say to it. “What, are you
nuts?”
I can't get over how stupid this is. Do these people ever override their need to feel important by acknowledging that someone has a solid idea?

I don't really understand what's going on here? ._.

Anonus · 2013-05-10 20:49:08

A cartoon called Ned's Newt was being pitched to Nickelodeon. They passed on it.

It was then taken to Fox Kids, who also passed on it. Then it was taken to Canada's Teletoon (an animation channel partially owned by the show's production company, Nelvana), who picked it up. With a few episodes done, the show was taken back to Fox, who chose to pick it up, but had no input in it beyond Standards and Practices.

Fox canceled the show after a couple of years so that Haim Saban had more room for shitty Pokémon cash-ins.

Imipolex G · 2013-05-10 21:43:11

I told you bro

I told you about television being crap

Obā-san · 2013-05-10 21:45:07

television has Too Cute and Adventure Time

and at one point it had Steve Irwin

also there are various nature documentaries that i loved when i was younger.

oh fuck thinking about steve makes me want to cry :/

Sredni Vashtar · 2013-05-10 21:46:15

That was pretty awful...

Anonus · 2013-05-10 22:03:59

^^:(

makes me want to cry too...

Salix Babylonika · 2013-05-10 22:17:20

has anyone seen his daughter's show? I've never seen it and don't know if it's any good.

I remember crying a lot when I heard he died.

Imipolex G · 2013-05-10 22:36:57

I was unaffected

lee4hmz · 2013-05-10 22:56:03

One of the big lessons I'm taking away from this is: Don't bother trying to make filet mignon—or even jalapeño-cheddar bratwurst, for that matter—when your bosses insist on making hot dogs. Also, LA is a shitty place to live.

lee4hmz · 2013-05-10 23:00:44

I also like that he singles out Funky Cancercancer by name later on.

Anonus · 2013-05-10 23:01:52

So do I.

Also, now I really don't understand why sitcoms had to be vehicles for heavy-handed morals. He never worked on it, but Full House seems to be the go-to example of this.

lee4hmz · 2013-05-10 23:05:23

Before pretty much every sitcom in the 1980s did it, All in the Family and M*A*S*H made it acceptable, basically.

Anonus · 2013-05-10 23:06:51

I never hear much about them being heavy-handed...

Also, before reading this, I had no idea that Norman Lear invented the Very Special Episode. That's something you don't see these days...

lee4hmz · 2013-05-10 23:12:58

All in the Family was designed from the start as a platform to discuss relevant issues, so it did the Very Special Episode with a lot more aplomb than most other shows. M*A*S*H was kind of forced into drama by Alan Alda (and, arguably, by how badly Vietnam ended), but from what I've heard about it it did things well, too. (Both shows had VSEs that won Emmys, and in M*A*S*H's case, it was also the series finale and still the most-watched non-sports program ever.)

By the 1980s, though, they were doing the sort of "knowing is half the battle" crap kids' shows were doing. It was obvious that they'd been approached by a charity or a pressure group to essentially make a PSA about this or that, and it was clunky and lame.

lee4hmz · 2013-05-10 23:20:06

And yeah, VSEs fell out of favor once most of the classic 1980s sitcoms ended. The last one I remember clearly was the story arc in Family Ties where the dad had a heart attack. And, honestly, pretty much every episode of Full House was a VSE, and they sometimes added in "advertisement for Disney" on top of that...at a time when ABC wasn't a Disney property yet.

Imipolex G · 2013-05-10 23:22:29

and now, a Very Special Episode of Heapers' Hangout

Anonus · 2013-05-10 23:23:28

I wonder what TV would be like if it weren't run by people who think their audience has the intellect of bread crumbs.

Anonus · 2013-05-10 23:23:57

lee4hmz said:
And yeah, VSEs fell out of favor once most of the classic 1980s sitcoms ended. The last one I remember clearly was the story arc in Family Ties where the dad had a heart attack. And, honestly, pretty much every episode of Full House was a VSE, and they sometimes added in "advertisement for Disney" on top of that...at a time when ABC wasn't a Disney property yet.

I always thought that was strange, too.

lee4hmz · 2013-05-10 23:25:22

It also weirded me out because Full House was very much not a Disney property, and still isn't; it was produced by Lorimar, which was bought out by WB two years after the show premiered.

Anonus · 2013-05-10 23:27:00

Which was later absorbed into Warner Bros. Television!

I think they made Roseanne do a Disney World episode too, but they made it evil. Roseanne isn't a Disney property, either; that's from Carsey-Werner.

Princess Alice · 2013-05-11 00:48:01

Honestly, when I think of the concept of a "Very Special Episode", the first thing that comes to mind is that Saved by the Bell episode where Jessie becomes "addicted" to caffeine pills. Is that weird?

It strikes me as a pretty textbook example of a sitcom ham-fistedly trying to address a serious topic.

Anonus · 2013-05-11 00:48:47

I saw a clip of it in the Nostalgia Critic's review of it. I think my first thought was "people were supposed to take this seriously?"

Justice4243 · 2013-05-11 00:50:48

and so on...

lee4hmz · 2013-05-11 15:12:42

I just had a "you know you're a programmer when..." moment while reading this: At one point, he mentions that he got paid $32,678 for a project, and my first reaction was "Hey, you wrote 32,768 wrong!"

Princess Alice · 2013-05-11 17:31:09

Heh.

For some reason I tend to think of the powers of two as the "purest"numbers. I don't know why.

lee4hmz · 2013-05-11 17:51:45

Also, I've seen bits and pieces of how pointy-headed Hollywood can be from types like those being made fun of on TTA and A!, but this is just amazing. :P

lee4hmz · 2013-05-11 17:56:11

Here are some of the things the sight or mention of which were forbidden on W.I.T.C.H.: Magic or spells or charms. Witches or wizards. References to anyone’s weight. Killing bugs or rats. Physical blows in fight scenes. The words ‘kill,’ ‘dead,’ or ‘death.’ Calling anyone ‘nuts’ or ‘crazy’ or ‘insane’ – mentioning a ‘nuthouse,’ ‘bughouse,’ etc. Bodily function humor. Any mention of kidnapping or abduction. Bras, or training bras, or underwear. Anyone riding a bike, skateboard, car, raft, boat, even in a mythical realm, without appropriate modern safety gear. Mentioning or seeing alcohol, cigarettes or coffee. Adoption. The phrase ‘Oh my God!’ Hell, or the Devil.

...I'm pretty sure Friendship is Magic is racier than this, to say nothing of pretty much all of WBA's shows. :P

Anonus · 2013-05-11 18:08:38

MLP:FIM has an episode in which two of the main characters are abandoned in a desert for no good reason (which is admittedly rather out-of-place on there), so it probably is.

I don't understand why witches and wizards weren't allowed on a show called W.I.T.C.H., but then again this guy got stuck with people who decided that Drexell's Class was not to be set in a classroom after a time...

I wonder what he'd think of working on MLP:FIM or Gravity Falls. I imagine he'd resent feeling stuck on a toy-based show, but that GF would be a lot of fun. I wonder how much freedom they get from the network...(By the way, Lee, Matt Chapman, that Matt Chapman, works on GF now)

Justice4243 · 2013-05-13 17:08:49

^^I think "Bridal Gossip" smashes quite a few of them.

The ponies have gotten quite physical with many of their opposition as well.

Imipolex G · 2013-05-13 17:14:43

you can't mention bras?!?!?!

Justice4243 · 2013-05-13 17:27:36

Also, MLP mentions magic like crazy. Not sure about "charms" but the word "curse" was used quite a few times in above mentioned episode.

Anonus · 2013-05-13 17:33:04

Justice42 said:
^^I think "Bridal Gossip" smashes quite a few of them.

The ponies have gotten quite physical with many of their opposition as well.

There's part of a fight scene in "A Canterlot Wedding" that I'm fairly sure was designed to appease S&P or whoever...that or just because it looked cool.

They don't get into physical scuffles very often on FIM, and I imagine part of that is because Hasbro doesn't think it's very appropriate for the audience or some shit.

So, things on that list I remember FIM doing:

-magic, spells, charms (two of the main characters can use magic)

-witches or wizards (unicorns in general)

-physical blows in fight scenes (done once in a blue moon)

-calling people 'nuts,' 'crazy,' or 'insane' ("She'll become a crazy cat lady!")

-bodily function humor (very rarely)

-references to kidnapping or abduction ("A Dog and Pony Show" wouldn't have existed if this weren't allowed)

-riding a boat without modern safety gear (Spike does this in "Dragon Quest")

Also, that prohibition on showing coffee is weird to me...

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